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Minnesota State University, Mankato
Minnesota State University, Mankato


Page address:

69th MSSA Senate
November 7, 2001 Minutes

Meeting called to order at 4:03 PM by Speaker Rachel D. Noah

Roll Call

Senators Present

Daniela Rumpf 12-0-0, Byron Pike 12-0-0, Beenish Malhi 6-1-0-1,Rachael Horne 11-1-0, Andrew Menden 12-0-0, Matt Osmundson 9-2-0, Richard Dueser 8-0-0, Brian Mullin 12-0-0, Jayson Read 12-0-0, Katie Garrity 12-0-0, Parrish Jones 111-0, Dan Peskorz-proxy Rhys Gaffer 6-3-3, Ryan Austad 71-0, Stephanie White12-0-0, Ashley Guetter 8-0-0,Omni Peterson 7-1-0, Adam Poole 11-0-0-1, Jason Casey 10-1-1, Monica Klein-proxy Jessica Boyc 10-0-2, Joe Muggli 12-0-0, Stacy Wiech 7-0-1, Ian Radtke 12-0-0, Zach Biesanz 7-0-1, James Tung 12-0-0 Cassandra Linkenmeyer 8-0-0

Senators Absent

Jacob Helgeson 5-5-0-2, Mikel Akers 11-1-0

Executive Staff Present

President Roger White Owl, Vice President Uzair Shaffi

Presentation-Mayor Jeff Kagermeier, Councilperson Mike Laven

The University has too many people living too close together. During last census Sawdust Realty did not exist-housing by baseball field did not exist. Now trying to determine wards in the city of

Mankato. It is best to have all precincts in Wards together, not as to have islands etc.

Geometric globs if possible. Wards must be equal. Population compactness, we are what is called a community of interests. Problem is that we need to divide university in someway,

Campus is part of Ward 3, Ward 5 is deficient by over 2,000 people. There is not equal opportunity for representation by councilpersons. There is a great concern on how students feel about this. Want students to have adequate representation, a person-1 vote. Would like a panel or committee to address this issue. Issue needs to be done by March.

Mike Laven-Not oblivious to the fact that students are all around area. Times have changed, need

students to be apart of the process

Senator Horne-What is all of Ward 5?

Mayor Kagermier-MSU is Ward 3. If a deal could be worked out between the two it would help ease things by 2,000 votes.

Proxy Gaffer-Students feel on campus should not be divided, off-campus students are close to campus but not on campus.

Senator Biesanz-In regards to options-Why did Gage or McElroy come up.

Mayor-It has to do with the continuity of the Wards. There are huge rental issues, another subject that

the city and university should get together on. I f you were to pull out of the university the logical

place would be of off-campus.

Proxy Gaffer-In regards to the way Wards are configured, in the next election would we be voting for someone else?

Mayor Kagermeier-That is correct.

Senator Muggli-In the deficiency in Ward 5 is that total population?

Major Kagermeier-There are census blocks, but they cannot break them up.

Proxy Gaffer-What is the deadline?

Mayor –January and completed by March.

Senator Dueser-Are you looking at other options besides McElroy?

Mayor -Absolutely, that is why we are here.

Senator Austad-Idealy-if you were doing this without the input of the college-do you have a plan?

Mayor-Yes, we would take Gage and McElroy and put them into Ward 5. We could have just done

this but we want university involvement.

Senator Casey-In all reality if we split the college-could this affect the Wards?

Mayor-Potentially this university could shape politics, you drive our economy, students are a very

important component. During the last election I talked to hundreds and hundreds of students, only 7 voted.

Senator Tung-What are the issues of Ward 5.

Mayor-They are trapped by Skyline, Stolsman Rd etc. They have no place to grow. Ward 3 area,

City cannot promote fast enough-city is growing by developers.

Approval of Agenda Agenda approved

Student Forum

Angela White Owl-Diversity week, November 12-17. Monday there will be panel in Ostrander, Tuesday a faculty staff panel, Wed. Diversity Expo, Thursday Unity March, Friday dinner and dance.

xxxxx-Alpha Eta Rho

I have been here a number of times before but we are still very concerned about Thunderbird now that they have signed the contract. Many students are boycotting and John Roberts has not affected the decision of the students-they can make decisions on their own.

Concerned with faculty overseeing the Flight school. MSU was on its way to accreditation-this

will not happen with Thunderbird. Advisory Committee will not do anything, input will mean nothing.

The Selection Committee they selected before hand selected another vendor, the Administration just said too bad. The biggest concern is that faculty with flight school is integral with ground.

Proxy Gaffer-Curious to know how many students feel the way you do.

xxxxxxxx-Do not know, but feel there is a huge majority of students. Thunderbird is taking a monopoly.

Students have composed a letter, this was a cooperative effort with students and faculty.

Senator Pike-What is happening at the airport with Thunderbird here?

xxxxxxx-Have only been out to the airport a couple times, I have no reason to go there, I won’t personally fly with them. They have brought in more aircraftbut it is nowhere near what Northstar had before. You used to have to schedule an appointment at least a week ahead of time to get on an aircraft, now you can get on any time and there are fewer aircraft. Students are going to the LeSueur airport and looking into Metro Flight School where credits can transfer. Thunderbird may even try to stop that.

Senator Muggli-What is your ultimate goal, can you invasion it with Thunderbird?

xxxxxxxxxx-I don’t see it surviving with Thunderbird unless there are extreme exchanges to the program. The program will die, we are not price competitive anymore.

Senator Biesanz-Do you know how many planes Thunderbird has compared to North Star

xxxxxxxx-Nine planes compared to 26.

Senator Pike- Can you give us an idea of how many students including yourself are contemplating leaving?

xxxxxxx-I really doubt if I will stay around and pay inflated prices to fly basically junky aircraft. A good majority of students have already called St. Cloud, Dubuque to transfer.

Senator Muggli-You stated that the Selection committee had no say, and Advisory will have no say.

Can you look at the Advisory as a positive and give it a try?

xxxxxxxxxx-We would be forced to give it a try. Selection committee choose who they wanted. Mankato Aviation will select two flight instructors of their choice (Steve Clements). The instructors that came down are not even MSU students, they came from the cities.

Senator Muggli-If it is out there will you at least give it a try?

Proxy Gaffer-How would you characterize changes to programs?

xxxxxxxxxx-#1, There is no faculty involvement at the airport. Pat McKenzie was told to move his books out of the airport office he shared with John Roberts. He was told that he can not advise flight instructors on flight training techniques or certain training that they might be having troble with. This is now Steve Clements job. There is no involvement with MSU on his side. As a university program, we need faculty involvement. Pat McKenzie is experienced. There is no faculty involvement, John Roberts is not on campus. No one will answer our phone calls. Dean and President will not meet with anyone.

Proxy Gaffer-It is important for someone to tell this body why this issue is so important. It seems there are problems with everyone understanding the importance of the issues. Why does this issue not die?

xxxxxxxxx-It your are a pilot you understand more. Flying is a way of life for Aviation students and will be for the rest of our lives and this is really messing with our way of life. In fraternity of flying one important thing you learn is ethics of aviation. In this case do not feel this has been upheld. Things have not been conducted well at all, with negations and Thunderbird.

Vice President Shaffi-Have you thought of starting a petition?

xxxxxxxxxxx-There was one started.

Senator Muggli-Can the students create an official grievance?

xxxxxxxxxxx-Students have taken votes in Fraternity Club and Alph Eta Rho to oppose Thunderbird . University does not listen. Do not answer our parents when they call.

Senator Horne-You said President and Dean will not take your calls, what else can you do?

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx-Maybe a sit-in,in front of the President’s office, maybe 300 students, but that is a last resort.

Senator Muggli-Wouldn’t it be better to do something formally?

xxxxxxxxxxx-I see a lack of professionalism in a sit-it, if it gets its point across it would be worth it. As far as the bureaucratic red tape, I don’t think a grievance will help, Dr. JoAnn Brandt was invited to this meeting and she never answered or showed up. We have been told we are a minority and the majority want to fly with Thunderbird, which is we don’t see, we see the majority not wanting to. We need all students to sit and maybe we will get questions answered. That’s all we want.

xxxxxxxxx-President of Aviation Club

Here today to plead case for aviation students as to why they are so upset. Trying to touch on a few things specifically majority/minority. Airport is running at ½ of capacity of what it should be for this time of the year. Last year at this time there were 26 planes having their wings flown off of them. They flew from 7:00 AM to sometimes 8-10 PM. Maybe 25 students are using airport on a daily basis. Two very different groups of students in program. Some just want to get their degree, fly and leave. Others are in the program to fly, get degrees and make the program better. These are the students that are upset.

When I was out at the airport I counted only 4 aircraft actually owned by Thunderbird. The other aircraft are called lease-back, people that own them are making some money on them by leasing them to Thunderbird aviation. This is a cheaper way for Thunderbird to have planes, some of these are being rented from Northstar aviation, our former aviation company. Another thing touched on is the Selection Committee-this past summer every member of committee received documents that had title Selection Committee on them. That means that every member could vote. We did that, we selected Company A but for several reasons they were not able to fulfill the contract for various reasons once of which was they asked for a five year contract and they did not get that. Thunderbird does now have that. There are so many things in the contract that other vendors did not have the opportunity to bid on. Student voices, parent voices, others from program have tried to meet with Dr. Boubel-she would not. A concerned parent came down and Dr. Boubel refused to meet with that parent. The parent had information on Thunderbird, they had researched this, even going so far as to go to the Chancellor. The Chancellor’s assistant did not know what a huge issue this is. I can’t stress to you enough how huge this is if you are an aviation student. We live our life by the planes we fly. To make you understand I would have to take the thing that you love the most and make you not want to do it because you are afraid you are going to stand against everything you are for. For any pilot in this room to not go to the airport and not get in a plane it is like ripping your heart out. Students in the program are not flying because they do not support Thunderbird. This is very hard for them. It is amazing because not flying is hard to do in the life of a pilot. Thunderbird signed contract Oct. 15. There were no aircraft for students to fly. This jeopardized every student that was close to soloing in their career. Everyday that you don’t fly is another day that you spend doing recurrent training to get your skills back to the point where you can fly at a student pilot level. This is apart of the issue that is infuriating students the most. There was an issue two weeks ago involving alumni and students apposing Thunderbird. Students received harassing phone calls. When I met with Dr. Boubel two weeks ago she told me that if I had any issues or concerns I could call her and she would get back to me. Personally received a call and called Dr. Boubel about this issue, she did not respond. I don’t know how to deal with this, they are smart enough to block the caller ID. Then we get to John Roberts, he is the heart and soul of the program. 20 years ago he created it. Thanks to him it is on the map and is a nationally recognized program. We don’t know why John Roberts is gone; he can’t go to the airport. The person I trust the most is gone-we can’t talk to him. This program will die if John Roberts is not reinstated. If John leaves many students will not stick around here because there will be nothing left to keep us here.

Proxy Gaffer-Why did parents come forward?

xxxxxxx-A Northwest Airline captain has a daughter in program-thought MSU was the best place for her. John Roberts being involved in the program was the biggest reason he got involved. Program was sold to them because our credits could go anywhere. We are going to lose that. We will even lose NCAA accreditation, can’t transfer to St. Cloud, Dubuque University of North Dakota. Those are three biggest aviation schools around here. This parent was not heard, even though he had first hand knowledge regarding Thunderbird Aviation, which is something the administration did not look into when they selected them.

xxxxxxxxx, alumni of aviation program. Involved in everything in the program and now lucky enough to fly for a regional airlines, Masaba Airlines. Work with at least 50 alumni. Everyone is upset. Students are getting shaft. What kind of university does not listen to students? We need quality education, was part of that education. Most students come here by word of mouth. Reputation is going down fast, alumni would not recommend anyone coming here or staying here. It is sad to see program go down hill. Alumni are embarrassed. Feel they should be hiring these students someday. Aviation industry is small and this news spreads fast. If prices are comparable to UND why would you come here with so much chaos going on?

Proxy Gaffer-Has the alumni of the aviation program taken any actions to try to keep the program going?

Alumni concerned that students will not graduate from good program, also what good does it do for alumni to say they graduated from a program that does not exist?

Approval of Minutes (10-31-01) Minutes approved with correction of spelling of Senator Osmundson’s name.

Officer Reports

President Roger White Owl

See correspondence from Dr. Boubel

Will make appointments to the Aviation Advisory Committee next week. Would like adhoc committee

to suggest names.

Will leave for Washington DC next week. Have copy of appointments-Senator Daschle will not be able

to meet but will be meeting with Senator Johnson.

Went to St. Cloud last week for an American Indian mascot protest rally. Peaceful. University should take a stance on this. It has not done so since the 1970’s.

Senator Muggli-Would- it be beneficial for the Aviation students to give you names of who they want on the committee?

Speaker Noah-Floor open to appointment of Chris Boyce to Ethics Commission - stayed from last week.

Proxy Gaffer-Last week I alluded to former Senator Jack Rector-read from minutes of April 11,2001

I object to certain things that President Boyce has done this year. You remember my letter to the editor when I proposed using my name and title he objected and did not want to involve the association. Having him say this hurt, and I do not think he had that right. I also am very offended at him leaving early. He is elected by the majority of students, he should be here now. Other senators have also discussed another issue, it concerns the gorilla cartoon. This implies that we are ignorant or stupid apes. Just because he disagrees, he does not have the right to insult the rest of us. I feel an apology is necessary.

As I was an Off-Campus senator last year, gorilla cartoon was very offensive. Felt this eluded to

Senate being apes. Strongly object to the way President Boyce related to staff and coordinators.

In consideration of his being on other committees, feel this would be inappropriate.

Senator Muggli/Senator Wiech

Move to not approve appointment of Chris Boyce to Commission on Ethics and Standards.

Senator Muggli- We don’t feel Chris Boyce would be the best one to judge us on ethics and standards since he did break them also.

Senator Wiech-For those of you that don’t know, the letter Senator Rector wrote was an argument on

why students don’t vote. I felt his title should have been on this. We took a stance on this and feel

all students should vote. This is not a personal grudge-when you want someone ethical former, President Boyce is not the best person.

Senator Dueser-Looked into key issue-have found a strong indication that Chris Boyce did not turn in

his key at the end of the year. Checked with Security-they will release this information. This is a violation of student’s rights and responsibilities.

President White Owl-In all honesty-he is synonymous with student government. He knows how government works. College of Social & Behavioral Science just awarded him the student of the year.

Don’t persecute him because of different opinions. Senator Rector could have used his title anyway.

Former President Boyce is ethical and understands how this works.

Senator Radtke-Don’t doubt he is ethical, yet also took offense to gorilla cartoon. Last year’s students

did not have a good feeling. He never addressed this issue. Agree with objection to appointment.

Proxy Gaffer-Felt he lacked professionalism in regards to people he worked with. He knows loopholes,

and right and wrong. It would behoove this body to take a took at his ability to sit in judgment.

Roll Call Vote

Senators voting Yes (do not appoint)

Daniela Rumpf, Byron Pike, Andrew Menden-proxy Jonathan Paul, Richard Dueser, Katie Garrity, Dan Peskorz-proxy Rhys Gaffer, Stephanie White, Joe Muggli, Ian Radtke, Monica Klein proxy Jessica Boyd, Stacy Wiech, Zach Biesanz

Senators voting No

Beenish Malhi, Brian Mullin, Parrish Jones, Ryan Austad, Omni Peterson

Senators Abstaining

Rachael Horne-proxy Jake Willis, Matt Osmundson, Jayson Read, Ashley Guetter, Adam Poole, Jason Casey-proxy Teritius Fortune, James Tung, Cassandra Linkenmeyer

Executive Staff Abstaining

Roger White Owl

Move to not approve appointment of Chris Boyce to the Commission on Ethics and Standards.

Motion passes

President White Owl will take recommendations for that appointment.

Proxy Gaffer-Aware that some people have put in applications for that committee, could Proxy

Boyd be considered?

Vice President Uzair Shaffi

Last week attended ACUI Regional Conference-student unions. Review how unions function.

Chancellor’s visit went well. Attended President’s Council. Council represents presidents from

many organizations-it is for organizing an event. Committee looked at organizing a recruitment fair

or information fair. Would like to request senators to encourage people to apply for Constitution

and Communication Board. This months Monitor-U.S. senators that would like to introduce legislation that would prevent the federal government from giving student visas to individuals from countries that the U.S. State Department considers to be sponsors of terrorism. Feel this is in violation of student’s rights.

Speaker Rachel D. Noah

Recognized Student Organizations

Muslim Student Association, African Student Association, MSU Soccer Club, Marantha Christian Fellowship. Discussion on Marantha Christian Fellowship

Senator Muggli-What grounds do we have for not approving an RSO?

Speaker-This particular student organization has followed almost all the rules. They have given us a list of all the students and the officers. The grounds would be up to you. I only recommended the approval.

Senator Biesanz-Object because they are responsible for harassing students by bringing back "Brother Jed" every year, that yells at students.

Senator Dueser-Can the students not recommend if they feel this organization harasses students?

Senator Garrity-Not agreeing with what the organization does is not grounds for not approving.

Senator Wiech-Object to the literature they pass out, it has a very strong anti homosexual stance.

Senator Gaffer-Do we know of students objecting to this organization?

Senator Muggli-Move to postpone the recommendation of this organization for one week.

Senator Muggli-There seems to be so much confusion and unanswered questions we should

look into this before approving.

Senator Gaffer-We live in the United State of America-I understand where you are coming from

but students can file a complaint or walk away. Stand against this motion and ask for approval

unless documentation comes forward.

Senator Radtke-Agree with Senator Gaffer –there are ways to address this, support approval of this RSO.

Coordinator Stafford-Why do you want to not approve this? See no basis for not recommending.

Senator Muggli

Move to postpone the recommendation of Marantha Christian Fellowship for one week

Roll Call

Senators voting Yes(vote to postpone)

Joe Muggli-Yes with Rights, Stacy Wiech

Senator Muggli-rights. I voted yes on this motion because it is simply a motion to postpone the recommendation for one week. This does not imply that I am against this organization, but questions have arisen regarding Marantha Christian Fellowship. The main concern to me is they define their parliamentary procedure as defined in the Bible, and to my knowledge the Bible has no parliamentary procedure in it.

Senators voting No

Byron Pike, Matt Osmundson, Brian Mullin, Jayson Read, Katie Garrity, Parrish Jones, Dan Peskorz-Proxy Rhys Gaffer, Ryan Austad, Stephanie White, Ashley Guetter, Omni Peterson, Adam Poole, Jason Casey-Proxy Teritius Fortune, Ian Radtke, Monica Klein-proxy Jessica Boyd

Senators Abstaining

Rachael Horne-proxy Jake Willis, Andrew Menden-proxy Jonathan Pahl, Richard Dueser, James Tung, Zach Biesanz-proxy Amanda Spangler

Motion fails

Safe Zone Training went well-disappointed that over ½ of you did not show up. Please follow through

Motion-#11.07.01A Academic Affairs/Adhoc Aviation Committee

Whereas: The Minnesota State University Mankato administration selected Thunderbird aviation as the aviation provider without the support of the student or faculty representatives on the selection committee and

Whereas: An overwhelming majority of aviation students as a group oppose the selection of Thunderbird Aviation and the continued presence of Thunderbird aviation as the aviation provider and,

Whereas: The contract negotiated with Thunderbird Aviation allows for major changes to the program which previously enjoyed a strong competitive edge in the aviation industry so be it,

Resolved: The MSSA Senate has strong opposition to the execution of the selection process; and so be it,

Resolved: The MSSA senate strongly opposes the selection of Thunderbird Aviation and the continued presence of Thunderbird Aviation as the provider; and so be it

Resolved: The MSSA senate strongly opposes the contractual agreement between Minnesota State University Mankato and Thunderbird Aviation.

Approval of motion, paragraph by paragraph.

Whereas: The Minnesota State University Mankato administration selected Thunderbird Aviation as the aviation provider without the support of the student or faculty representatives on the selection committee and,

Senator Pike-This is factual as we have spoken to many students and they all say did not support

Thunderbird aviation.

Proxy Gaffer-Object to the word student as they were there for consultation and not being anything other

then that.

Senator Garrity-It is a true statement.

Senator Dueser-It is undeniable true, student was a consultant but they proceeded with out this

consultation. Statement is accurate.

President White Owl-This has been long and ongoing.

Paragraph Passes

Whereas: An overwhelming majority of aviation students as a group oppose the selection of

Thunderbird Aviation and the continued presence of Thunderbird Aviation is the aviation provider and,

Senator Pike-Have talked to many students and the lack of planes is strong support against Thunderbird.

Senator Dueser-Also had discussions with many students and feel this is accurate.

Senator Muggli-Feel we should not object to Thunderbird but the process.

Proxy Pahl-The presence of Thunderbird at the airport is at a cost to the program and students.

Paragraph Passes

Whereas: The contract negotiated with Thunderbird Aviation allows for major changes to the program which previously enjoyed a strong competitive edge in the aviation industry so be it,

Senator Pike-This leaves many things wide open-contract says we can change to a Part 141-this would not be beneficial to the students. Faculty also had a large involvement; they could apply hands on to

classroom. They no longer even have offices.

President White Owl-This says we are opposed and we should support our aviation students. Adhoc

should go to committee first. This will give students on Advisory committee a stronger voice.

Senator Dueser-Byron Pike has devoted time to becoming an expert on the contract. The contract

does allow things to be changed including faculty presence. This makes major changes that would

allow students to be less competitive

Paragraph Passes

Resolved: The MSSA senate has strong opposition to the execution of the selection process; and so be it,

Senator Pike-The adhoc committee has talked to students and administration. We see many violations.

Proxy Fortune-Spoke to students that says they just want a provider even if it is Thunderbird if they could get back in the air.

Proxy Willis-Those students don’t care if the program survives after they are gone, they only care about

their degree

Proxy Pahl-Have tried to remain unbiased but have heard students say that they don’t care because they are not paying for it. This goes against those of us that do pay for our education.

Paragraph Passes

Resolved: The MSSA senate strongly opposes the selection of Thunderbird aviation and the continued presence of Thunderbird Aviation as the provider; and so be it,

Senator Muggli-I am not so sure that I have this objection of Thunderbird Aviation-the Aviation students

have this objection-maybe not MSSA senate. If it said Aviation students oppose but not MSSA.

Senator Garrity-I care about the program and this affects students if it would cause them to leave. We can

say we oppose even though we are not aviation students.

Proxy Pahl-Feel our voice has not been heard-and hope yours will be able to be heard. Have a letter

from parent with information.

Proxy Willis-Feel the senate is the voice of the students, aviation feels they are speaking for us.

Senator Pike-We can discuss Thunderbird on campus because this represents 300+ students. We want

students here. If we can’t recruit it affects all of us.

Proxy Gaffer-Everything up until this point has talked about how the students are opposing something,

as a group we need to be supportive of the students opposing this selection. This portion should be voted down because of wording. We need to clarify.

Senator Garrity-Encourage you to pass this because we need to have an opinion because of students.

Senator Muggli-I think we should say we support aviation students in this opposition.

Senator Poole-I believe there is a better way but it is not as strong as saying senate.

President White Owl-Many questions in general –maybe refer this back to Academic Affairs to iron this

out. Iron out wording. Move to committee

Paragraph Passes

Resolved: The MSSA senate strongly opposes the contractual agreement between Minnesota State

University Mankato and Thunderbird Aviation.

Proxy Gaffer-Have problems with the working of contractual agreement-we don’t have rights to

Talk about contractual agreement. We have rights to oppose lack of student consultation.

There is a better way to say it, vote this down.

Senator Muggli-A strong enough statement has already been made, this seems repetitive. Vote down.

Senator Pike-This is not against contractual part, but what can hurt students. We are allowed to have an opinion. We are not for it because the contract was so broad.

Senator Dueser-The reason we oppose the contract is because the program would be damaged because Thunderbird can make changes. We have a right to oppose this agreement because we can have an

opinion of what is good or bad for us.

Senator Garrity-Do not feel this is redundant. This is about damaging the program.

Paragraph passes

Consideration of the whole

Motion passes unanimously Abstain Coordinator Fortune

Coordinator Reports

Keenan Stafford-Cultural Diversity Coordinator

Cultural Diversity Week November 12-16. Will be helping out. Need people to volunteer time setting up and cleaning up.

In order to make sure we are more diverse I talked to the Latino Association tonight. Safe Zone-

could not attend because of a test.

Senator Garrity-Can you get this training from the LGBC?

Coordinator Stafford-I will try to get material.

Joe Muggli-Student Services Coordinator

Issues raised regarding attorney-Steve Behn is no longer with the firm. We are contracted with the

Halverson Law firm. I recommend that we not break the contract. Mark Halverson has been willing to

work with students if you ask him. He gave me a case breakdown from 1999-2001. If you have questions please ask.

Proxy Gaffer-As far as the official process to document, how do we go about that?

Coordinator Muggli-You could file a complaint with the President.

Senator Pike-When is the contract up?

Senator Muggli-The contract is up June 30. We can ask him to come before us.

Committee Reports

SAC-Byron Pike, Chair

SAC R#11.7.01A

SAC recommends funding up to $50.00 for the Finance Club to travel to Chicago

for an information gathering trip.

Senator Gaffer-This trip has already taken place, how can we tell organizations that they can come before us before their event?

Chair Pike-We have given information to SLD&SL to give to organizations. We have this in the information we give out.

Motion passes

Student Union Board, Rhys Gaffer

Student Union Board met last week and received the budget proposal for 2002-2003. The Director recommends an increase in student fee from $6.55 to $11.16 per credit hour. This is an increase of $4.61 or approximately $55 per semester. Phase I and II projects have been authorized for bonding by Minnesota State. The amount to be bonded will be $7.7 million. Student Union staff will work with Minnesota State

to have deferred maintenance line item deferred to next year. Proposed increase is the worst case scenario. Possibility that the fees won’t go that high.

Senator Muggli-How were students able to choose what they felt important?

Chair Gaffer-As surveys show from Master Planning-students overwhelmingly wanted dining services

renovated. This includes all things on first floor. Student consultation was very much there.

Senator Muggli-Were prices attached to renovations?

Chair Gaffer-There were no prices, audit gave starting points on deferred maintenance of Phase I and II.

No price was given.

Senator Mullin-Do you think there was a bias in where the planning was done?

Chair Gaffer-There were other surveys done by Dr. Vessi and students involved in this process.

Senator Pike-In your best opinion-do you think students understood how much they would be paying?

Chair Gaffer-Planning process could be construed as a wish list but as surveys were taken into account

the original cost was under $14 million, by bonding together it shows student union staff is trying to be

fiscally responsible. $7.7 will be for renovation of dining services. What hurts is that Minnesota State has taked

on deferred maintenance. Henry Morris is trying to do something about that. The Legislature has not been very responsible for students in taking care of their assets.

Parking Advisory, Rhys Gaffer

Faculty Association made a motion to gain more and better parking on campus. This was tabled so we

could discuss this.

Four points #1 Gold and street purple parking along Maywood-convert to faculty and staff parking.

#2 75 light green spots could be converted to Gold. #3 Graduate off-campus students could purchase remaining gold permits at a 75% lesser rate of gold permit.

#4 Freeze gold prices from going up in two year increments.

#1-Faculty want to be closer to where they work. #2 Green is desirable parking. Resident Hall people

know this is a good deal. Faculty is also asking to expand Lot 17 from purple to gold. Convert Lot

18 to green to make up difference in lost spots for residence hall students.

This is big. We don’t have sufficient representation on the Board. Appreciate that faculty want to park

closer to their building like faculty and staff in gold behind Gage. Faculty and staff have a 60/40 advantage over students. Very interested in not working fast on this. Would like to hear how students

feel about this. Faculty has gone through extensive research on this. The Faculty Association feels that if they can not have parity, students should have to pay an equal amount to park in res hall spots.

Senator Muggli-How many spots are they requesting?

Chair Gaffer-In regards to lot 13-68 to 69 spots. Parking on street-approximately 30-40 along horseshoe area. Conversion of lot 17 to Gold-approximately 30-40 stalls. Don’t have exact figures.

Senator Pike-What is the voting number of faculty and staff and students?

Chair Gaffer-6 voting members-2 of which are students.

Senator Garrity-Does the Parking Advisory have the only right to changing parking policies

Chair Gaffer-This does not come before senate, it is a university committee.

Proxy Fortune-6 voting members and 2 students. How many students are nonvoting?

Chair Gaffer-We have 1 other student, Coordinator Fortune, we are allowed two voting members.

Chair Gaffer-Would like official directive from this body and see if we can have more students.

President White Owl-We need to talk to Mr. David Cowan.

Senator Dueser-Have you considered asking students about this?

Motion #11.07.01B Senator Wiech/Senator Dueser

Direct the student representatives on the university Parking Advisory Committee (PAC)

to inquire of PAC Chair about how to get more student voting members on the committee, and report back to the senate at the next meeting.

Speaker ruled out of order for more clarification or wording

Senator Reports

Social & Behavioral Science Ryan Austad

Keep up on current events and how they affect other people. I also try to pick up at least one piece of

garbage on campus everyday. I chose to come here and I can do this and lead by example. I have spoke to History professor and he spoke about us allowing Technology to take over 3rd floor of library. Felt

we should not bow to this. Library space is very valuable. Now on Judicial Board, have not been

called yet. Was goal judge for women’s hockey. Art work-by the water fountain-it is becoming

decrepit. The red is rusting, maybe we could do some up keep. Having fun on senate and

enjoy learning about what goes on behind the lines.

Undeclared-Ashley Guetter

PSEO Post Secondary Education Options program-started in 1985 by Governor Perpich. Wanted a more vigorous secondary program. Now 7,100 students participating. 255 students enrolled at MSU.

Proxy Fortune-What is the maximum of credits you can take?

Senator Guetter-16 credits per semester.

Senator Mullin-Do they also pay for room and board?

Senator Guetter-No, you have to pay for that yourself.

Senator Pike-Is the course work more challenging?

Senator Guetter-Not the courses but the method of teaching.

Senator Guetter-MSUSA Chat room is up.

Proxy Fortune-Can you still attend your high school prom?

Graduate Studies-Matt Osmundson

Been busy grading papers, etc. President White Owl-setting up meeting with

Ethnic graduate students. Will gladly speak to any group. Will be on the Graduate Dean Search

Committee. Regarding Supreme court visit-they were not here for college students, it was for

high school students only. The dinner was by invite.

Off-Campus-Stacy Wiech

Two points-pick up the Monitor-quoted regarding Media Conference. Wear brown uniform

because I work at the jail. Many other police officers are here as well, treat them properly.

Proxy Fortune-Don’t you need a license to arrest someone?

Senator Wiech-You do need a license.

Senator Radtke-How does citizen arrest work then?

Graduate Studies-Richard Dueser

Issues important to grad students-possibility of getting dependent health insurance, student housing for married students, state law restricts grad students from working over 40 hours. Many grad students

are restricted even if they don’t have many classes. GA contract allows no provision for sick days.

Grad students could be in a bind if an instructor didn’t accept this.

Little concerned about line regarding selection process in motion we passed-I think a better way would be

Resolved: The MSSA senate has strong oppostion to the way the aviation vendor selection process was executed; and so be it

Senator Radtke-Are you aware of Master Planning having any married housing?

Senator Dueser-Not aware of any planning because there has not been a strong voice.

This issue requires study and work.

Motion Senator Dueser/Senator Radtke

Resolved: The MSSA senate has strong opposition to the way the aviation vendor selection process was executed; and so be it,

Move to reconsider paragraph four of motion

Senator Radtke-good clarification, it would make sense.

Motion passes


Seantor Mullin-Hockey is playing U of M this weekend.

Senator Radtke-Sun Nov 18 4:00 AM-Media shower Stanford Observatory

Speaker-Three meetings left-everyone needs to do reports.

A follow up is a second part of a question, only if original question was not answered.

Information corner-clean up if you have put things there that are done.

Proxy Gaffer-AFSCME could be back on strike. Call or email legislature to ratify contract.

Adjournment 8:05 PM

Roll Call

Students Present

Byron Pike, Matt Osmundson, Richard Dueser, Brian Mullen, Jayson Read, Katie Garrity, Dan Peskorz-Proxy Gaffer, Ryan Austad, Stephanie White, Ashley Guetter, Adam Poole, Jason Casey-proxy Teritius Fortune, Monica Klein-proxy Jessica Boyd, Joe Muggli, Stacy Wiech, Ian Radtke, James Tung

Students Absent

Daniela Rumpf, Beenish Malhi, Rachael Horne, Andrew Menden, Parrish Jones, Omni Peterson, Jacob Helgeson, Mikel Akers, Zach Biesanz, Cassandra Lindenmeyer

Executive Staff Present

President Roger White Owl